Many ministry leaders begin their journey with a genuine desire to serve. But somewhere along the way, leadership can quietly become something else. 

Platforms grow. Expectations rise. Applause becomes affirmation. And before long, influence begins to shape identity.

Eric Reid spent years traveling the world teaching leadership alongside John Maxwell. From the outside, it looked like success. But internally, Eric began to notice a troubling pattern. 

Leadership had become a performance, a way to earn approval rather than simply serve people.

In this conversation with Matt Davis, Eric reflects on the personal awakening that led him to write Leadership Was Never My Calling. 

Together they unpack the deep tensions many leaders carry: the pull toward platform, the pressure to perform, and the quiet invitation of Jesus to step down the ladder and serve with humility.

When a beloved role ends, identity gets loud. 

In this candid conversation, Joshua Gordon traces his journey from ministry-adjacent entrepreneur to a surprising new assignment after his business collapsed in COVID. A trusted friend’s hard words, deep prayer, and patient community became “spiritual physio” that restored his sense of self in Christ.

We talk about the gap between intention and impact in church transitions, why being “driven” can hide quiet desperation, and how to hear God’s still small voice before things are literally on fire. 

Josh shares the practical and pastoral moves that protected his marriage, his kids, and his future calling.

If you are a leader facing an ending, a board guiding one, or a pastor recovering from one, this episode offers language, wisdom, and hope. Faithfulness isn’t empire building. It’s walking with Jesus in ordinary choices that shape a lifetime.

When crisis hits the church you love, what holds you together? Pastor and author Steve Carter sits down with us to tell the real story behind stepping off a major platform for the sake of integrity - and what it cost.

From the shock of headlines to the quiet of the desert, Steve unpacks a framework for grieving honestly, breathing deeply, and receiving what’s next. 

His language of Holy Weekend helps leaders locate themselves in Friday, Saturday, and Sunday without pretending away the scars.

We also talk family. Secondhand wounds, first-person healing, and helping kids make meaning when adults are fighting. 

Finally, Steve shares how calling to a place led him back to Chicagoland and into the lead pastor seat at Christ Church of Oak Brook - holding ambition and formation together without shortcuts.

What if waiting until you’re ready keeps you from ever starting? 

In this episode of Life After Ministry, Matt Davis sits down with Holly Tate, founder of The Ready Network, to talk about leadership, courage, and stepping into the unknown.

Holly shares her own story of transition - from years at Vanderbloemen, to joining Leadr, to launching her own work helping leaders and teams move from stuck to unstuck. 

Along the way, she opens up about fear, the myth of readiness, and how emotional intelligence shapes the future of ministry leadership.

For pastors, boards, and ministry leaders wrestling with change, this episode offers both empathy and clarity: you don’t have to have it all figured out. You just need the courage to take the next step.

What if the scariest thing about leaving ministry wasn’t the loss of your job - but the loss of your identity? 

In this episode, Matt sits down with Josh Taylor, former executive pastor turned chief marketing officer, who opens up about what it’s really like to step off the platform and into the unknown. 

From twelve years of trusted leadership in a growing church to a surprising turn through a university layoff and a marketing agency for car washes, Josh’s story is full of quiet pivots, faithful risk-taking, and unexpected grace.

But this isn’t just about changing careers. It’s about the slow death of pride, learning to hear God's voice outside the church walls, and becoming the kind of husband, father, and friend you were always meant to be.

If you’ve ever wondered what ministry looks like when your title disappears - or felt a holy nudge toward “something more” - this conversation will meet you right where you are.

What do you do when God asks you to let go of the dream you’ve built your life around? Wade Joye, former worship leader at Elevation Church, shares his personal story of facing that very question. In this episode of Life After Ministry, Wade opens up about the moment Pastor Steven Furtick asked him to consider if he was willing to release what he was good at to embrace what God was calling him to be great at. Wade wrestled with letting go of his role as a worship leader—a dream he thought would last a lifetime—but in surrendering it, he discovered a deeper purpose.

Dr. Michael Schaefer shares his journey of transitioning out of full-time ministry and starting G6 Allies, a ministry that supports pastors and church leaders. He discusses the challenges he faced, including being blindsided by his termination and the impact it had on his family. Despite the difficulties, he found healing and purpose in helping other pastors and their families through G6 Allies. He also shares his experience of starting G6 Church and the importance of building resilient Christian leaders. Overall, his story highlights the resilience and faithfulness of God in the midst of life's challenges.

Tom Dyke shares his journey from ministry to starting his own business. He discusses his background in Manitoba, Canada, and his various roles in ministry, including being a youth pastor and overseeing family ministries. Tom initiated his departure from ministry due to challenges within the church and found a new calling in marketing and storytelling. He shares his financial success in his new business and challenges the poverty mindset often associated with pastors. Tom emphasizes the importance of family and creating lasting memories, and how his relationship with money has evolved. He also discusses how his pastoral skills continue to impact his interactions in the business world.

In the inaugural episode of the Life After Ministry Podcast, hosts Matt and Marilee Davis open up about their own journey post-ministry. 

With vulnerability, they discuss the challenges and opportunities they encountered as they transitioned into a new career, community, and even way of life. 

The episode digs into the complexities of untangling emotional and spiritual intricacies that come with leaving a ministry role. 

Whether you're a pastor contemplating a career change, or a leader helping someone through this significant life transition, this episode offers invaluable insights on navigating the journey with wisdom and grace. 

Don't miss this heartfelt and informative debut.